Bob Jones Third speaks on the GRACE report

Radio interview with Bob Jones Third, Chancellor of Bob Jones University, on September 27, 2015, with Roisin McAuley of the BBC (this section first posted at WutBJU, full interview here). Commentary on BJ3’s remarks is posted below.

The part of the interview pertaining to the GRACE report is transcribed here, with commentary on his remarks posted below.

BBC: You have had some issues about sexual abuse, because I understand that initially, is it not the case that when students reported sexual abuse the perpetrator was not handed over to the authorities, because that was to be, in the words that I read in the [GRACE] report, anyway, a betrayal of Jesus Christ to do so.

BJ3: No, no that’s totally false, and I’m glad you asked that question because I’m happy to set that record straight. The University voluntarily, three years ago, sought an ombudsman, a totally independent ombudsman, to investigate any claims that any of our graduates had that they were not properly counseled on matters of sexual abuse. These were issues that occurred in the lives, tragic instances, of these students before they came to us, and had real needs.

And so there was a time three, four years ago, when there was a sense that somehow religion was hiding these dark awful things and even countenancing them, and we wanted to be on record, my son Stephen who was  president at that time, said we want to be up front—there had been no charges, nothing—said, “We want to be transparent for the world to see that Christians do not hide sin or make excuses for it.” And so this group was hired and they did this and they interviewed. Out of 95,000 former students, there were some 40 cases who arose out of 88 years of history and said we don’t think we were counseled properly.

Now that’s a pretty insignificant number of people. The University came out of this looking very, very good, and the few people who said, “We think that the perpetrators should have been turned over to the police and the University hid it,” the local police interviewed every one of those  people in the report who said that. They investigated it independently, and they have publicly declared to the media and to all of the world who wants to listen, “We found not one instance of Bob Jones University hiding from the police any criminal action whatsoever,” so praise God that that is so.

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This part posted by Rebecca; this is a reposting of the statement above, with my commentary in bold italic.

You have had some issues about sexual abuse, because I understand that initially, is it not the case that when students reported sexual abuse the perpetrator was not handed over to the authorities, because that was to be, in the words that I read in the [GRACE] report, anyway, a betrayal of Jesus Christ to do so.

I’ve heard things from individuals about “betrayal of Jesus Christ,” but don’t see it in the report. The unstated reason was more along the lines of “this is an internal matter, and we’ll handle it.”

BJ3: No, no that’s totally false . . .

It most certainly is not totally false. It is absolutely true that when student reported sexual abuse the perpetrators were not handed over to the authorities. 

. . . and I’m glad you asked that question because I’m happy to set that record straight. The University voluntarily, three years ago, sought an ombudsman, a totally independent ombudsman, to investigate any claims that any of our graduates had that they were not properly counseled on matters of sexual abuse.

The University did it voluntarily in the sense that there was no pending court case, but there was a good bit of background to it. Some information about that background is detailed here: http://bjugrace.com/why-has-there-been-a-sexual-abuse-investigation-at-bju

BJ3: These were issues that occurred in the lives—tragic instances—of these students before they came to us, and had real needs.

Here he implies that all the incidents of abuse took place before the students came to BJU. The GRACE report shows that half of the 166 BJU-related sexual abuse victims who completed their survey experienced their abuse before coming to BJU and half experienced their abuse while associated with BJU.

BJ3: And so there was a time three, four years ago, when there was a sense that somehow religion was hiding these dark awful things and even countenancing them, and we wanted to be on record, my son Stephen who was  president at that time, said we want to be up front—there had been no charges, nothing—said, “We want to be transparent for the world to see that Christians do not hide sin or make excuses for it.”

That is actually not what was said at all. This is the statement from Stephen Jones: http://bjugrace.com/what-is-this-all-about/statement-from-stephen-jones-upon-hiring-grace/

BJ3: And so this group was hired and they did this and they interviewed. Out of 95,000 former students, there were some 40 cases who arose out of 88 years of history and said we don’t think we were counseled properly.

These numbers completely misrepresent the facts. First of all, the number of 95,000 former students is meaningless. A significant percentage of those are dead. Many of them have nothing to do with BJU so they would never even hear about such a thing as an investigation. Even many of those who have kept up with BJU said they never heard about the investigation until after the interviewing was over. (Also, I don’t know where he got the number 40, except from Steve Pettit’s announcement in March. It doesn’t appear to be in the GRACE report.)

Because Jim Berg has said that he counseled 200-300 sexual abuse victims per year during his tenure as Dean of Students, the real number to look at is the number of sexual abuse victims who interacted with GRACE vs. the number of those who said they their case was handled badly.

All of that information is in the GRACE report. It says that 166 sexual abuse survivors who received counsel at BJU filled out the survey.  This, according to Jim Berg’s own admission, would represent a very small percentage of the people who actually had been sexually abused who were at BJU.

The GRACE report also said that over 60% of those who filled out the survey, which would be around 100 people, believed that the counsel they were given was  damaging and their case was handled wrongly. This is a significant percentage.

BJ3: Now that’s a pretty insignificant number of people.

It is truly appalling how flippantly he dismisses these people that compose 60% of the Investigative Sample.

BJ3: The University came out of this looking very, very good,

Does it? Perhaps for people who have not read the GRACE report, but instead simply believe what he and other supporters of the University have said about it.

BJ3: and the few people who said, “We think that the perpetrators should have been turned over to the police and the University hid it,”

He is about to flippantly dismiss this huge problem.

BJ3: the local police interviewed every one of those  people in the report who said that.

What an incredible statement, and blatantly false. The local police did no such thing. For one thing, they didn’t even know who these people were unless the people themselves chose to tell them. For another thing, we at BJUGrace know for sure of more than one who tried to pursue reporting their case to the police, and  their phone calls were not returned.

BJ3: They investigated it independently, and they have publicly declared to the media and to all of the world who wants to listen, “We found not one instance of Bob Jones University hiding from the police any criminal action whatsoever,”

This is a blatant falsehood. The police did not say this. Rather, they said, “Insufficient evidence exists to establish probable cause or prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Bob Jones University employees failed to report knowledge of criminal sexual conduct against juvenile students,” according to the Greenville News report here: http://www.greenvilleonline.com/story/news/local/2015/07/21/greenville-police-conclude-investigation-bob-jones-university/30427839/  This is very different from saying that they found not one instance of BJU had hid any criminal action. The police were simply saying that they didn’t have enough evidence. Yet we at BJUGrace know that when former victims asked to see their BJU files, they found that significant evidence of their reporting their abuse was missing. 

BJ3: so praise God that that is so.

We hope that people who hear Bob Jones Third’s statements will take time to see for themselves the misrepresentations of the truth that he is presenting. You can access the full GRACE report here:  http://static1.squarespace.com/static/54596334e4b0780b44555981/t/552e9be7e4b0498e9c4b8c24/1429117927390/Bob+Jones+U+Final+Report.pdf